Changes coming again while Big Island moves to 100% arrival testing + Kauai starts mandatory 14-day quarantine today.
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I live on Maui.. we’ve had roughly 542 cases…in 9 months!!!!!
For perspective that is less the amount of people who live on a single street in my neighborhood…
Yet, somehow everyone us ok with the complete poverty and economic destruction that is coming over the next 2-3 years….
The Great Recession basically started on Oct. 7th 2007. Bottom of the housing market out here occurred in very late 2010 or early 2011… Back then we saw roughly 10% less travel activity. We now are seeing 70% less travel activity. This will make the Great Recession look like the a warmup. And it is all self induced.
The devastation is coming and somehow a majority would rather ban tourists ( that aren’t spreading the Vid) than avoid poverty, foreclosures, and loss of any accumulated wealth over the last 8 yrs.
I can almost guarantee Hawaii will have less overall deaths this year than in years past. (since we will be somehow missing 500+ flu deaths)
These continuous changes to Hawaii’s Covid19 travel guidelines, testing, and quarantine times, we’re rethinking travel plans that exclude Hawaii. Too many uncertainties for the travel expense.
All I know is that in my lifetime I have never known a virus to 1) cause this amount of commotion and insanity. 2) To behave in a way where infections suddenly increase exponentially months later. So either, we were attacked again by this virus or the numbers are far from accurate and there is way too much testing going on. It’s a fact that these tests are highly inaccurate. There are far more false positives than false negatives (human intervention?). People have tested within the same day and received different results. How can anyone rely on such data? Plus, when they do retest, it’s added into the count as another positive. It’s just crazy. There is so much gaslighting happening right now (100% intended) that no one knows where’s up and where’s down. We are in a very sad state of affairs – for many reasons.
Also, people have compared this to the Spanish flu of 100 +/- years ago? However, there’s a piece of information about that flu that is conveniently left out; the military men on the ships which are supposedly considered a large portion of the deaths, actually died from Scurvy and not the Spanish Flu. But, those deaths were counted as flu deaths. Sound familiar?
I have a feeling, and it’s something that would never get disclosed for feel of public retaliation, that the common flu is a contributor to the case counts. If these tests, which as you correctly say, are not completely accurate, are mislabeled flu as Covid, it could explain the dramatic rise in positives without the dramatic rise in deaths.
Not saying there is not a virus that is more deadly, but that the suspicious disappearance of the flu this year coupled with the general publics insane response to merely case counts is astounding.
In 2018, the flu flooded hospitals as well. It is possible that the flu along with Covid is the issue. But everything is getting labeled Covid.
Actually, many covid related deaths are not be counted as the person did not receive a confirmation test before dieing. This mostly applies to the elderly and the poor. This was first apparent in New York and Florida.
Also- going to 96 hours makes no sense. Your just shuffling the risk around- more strict on the boarding rules (no test upon boarding = 14 day quarantine rule ) but less strict on the Pre-test window (more risk of infection preceding flight). Glad we (kauai) opted out of this mess.
“Timbers has purchased more guest monitoring bracelets. The large property adjacent to Lihue Airport does not have beach access. Rates start at $874 per night with a minimum 4-night stay, in the off-season.”
What’s not to like?!
Sounds like a circa 1978 episode with Hervé Villechaize and Ricardo Montalban…
“De Plane! De Plane!”
“Smiles everyone, Smiles!”
“My dear guests, I am your host, Mr. Roarke…Welcome to Fantasy Island!!!
😂😂😂
Clearly none of these clowns are really qualified or competent to lead a Scout troop–let alone an entire state. So, hopefully the voters will vote no to ALL of the morons in public office in Hawaii that have essentially bankrupted the state and the counties in 2020 by refusing to not only allow but encourage safe travel to the islands thus far.
Hawaii is unique among states in that it has multiple islands… that are each unique destinations. Due to that reality the state–without a doubt–should have the ability to make and enforce public health policies and procedures for ALL of the islands–that is consistent–and based in science.
Currently, these ____ (county mayors and state officials) are literally arguing over the 1% of the 1% of the 1%. The infection rate of any given group of visitors to Hawaii right now would already be extremely small–even without pre-travel testing. Add THAT element to the filter and we’re talking less than .1% of people getting on a plane to Hawaii right now are likely to have COVID. And then what percentage of the total local population is that less than 1% going to come into contact with while here / while contagious? .00000001%? And what percentage of those people are likely to actually contract the virus from someone–when everyone is wearing masks and social distancing? .00000001%?
The whole conversation is retarded. Life–and public health policy–is never about eliminating all risk. It’s about reducing the risk to a reasonable level… and we were already there just with mask wearing and social distancing. We didn’t even need 1 test–let alone 2–let alone quarantine. It’s like these guys are actively competing to see who can be the biggest dumb a__ on the islands… and right now, that’s a race that’s too close to call.
The antigen tests proposed by Josh Green may give fast results but they also are highly inaccurate and lead to false positive results, especially if they are not administered correctly. I am very concerned that the mass testing that would need to be done at or near the airport may be done by inexperienced or incompetent personnel. I am also concerned that it could violate privacy rights of travelers, as the state would have automatic access to privileged medical records. This may lead to perfectly healthy asymptomatic travelers not only being forced to quarantine for 14 days but also not being allowed to return home for at least 21 days after obtaining a negative test result, as no airline will allow them on board. This could lead to travelers being imprisoned in Hawaii at their own expense for over a month. This is as I feared becoming too risky for any traveler to undertake without severe consequences.
The political posturing is getting in the way of real solutions here. Although Josh Green was a trustworthy voice earlier in the pandemic, once his name became attached to this pre-travel testing program, you need to view his statements within the understanding of his political incentives. He is repeatedly presenting the data in a dishonest way.
To wit:
* Green is correct that the overall counts are stable in the islands. But unless there is a catastrophic failure of the program that should be expected. At the start of the program, Oahu was still getting past their large surge of cases. So the natural declines of that case load are hiding the increases elsewhere.
* The program is very clearly failing to keep Maui, Lanai, and Kauai from experiencing case increases. Counties other than Kauai are failing to fully disclose the numbers that are required to expose this. Kauai is reporting daily cases from visitors that arrived with a negative pre-arrival test, and there is absolutely no reason to believe that’s not happening elsewhere. Other islands are just hiding those details.
Unfortunately there is no way to make the islands actually safer without requiring a post-arrival mandatory quarantine period. Due to incubation periods, a test immediately upon arrival is just security theater. So the politicians and people of Hawaii are left with a choice between certain increases in death or certain economic destruction. There are no good answers until a vaccine is here.
Well put Chris! Here’s the other thing. The choice between deaths and economic destruction is completely one that our politicians have created. In other developed nations, the government is simply making up for some/all of the lost income to people due to the pandemic. Here in the US we refuse to do that.
a few trillion in aid wasn’t enough?
A few trillion here, a few trillion there. Pretty soon, you’re talking real money.
It just gets more bizarre every week. I cancelled all plans to visit Hawaii this year. It’s foolish to make plans when rules change weekly and various islands have their mayor’s make up rules and closing islands. I was planning a June 2021 vacation there, but now changing that to Bahamas or other Caribbean island. I can see this confusion and political inter quarreling to continue onward through next year. Hawaii will be in bankruptcy as the politician’s are clueless with their own agendas.
Kauai has already figured out how to make up for lost visitor revenues. They slapped an additional 17% increase on property tax for only out of state rental condo owners, like me. Really?
On top of that, if your property is a Legal, licensed vacation rental, your property taxes are increased by an additional 50% (because you are a business, you know), even though the county has forbidden anyone from renting one for almost the entire year.
I am waiting for the class action to address this. Rental properties should be taxed at homestead rate for 2020 at best.
That’s mayor Kawakami’s and his big tech friends over tourism control plan that I commented about on an earlier thread.
Shut down the island to tourism and raise taxes on out of state owned short term vacation condos. Which will force the owner to sell at below market value to a local family ending the housing shortage.
That is until there’s no more local families to qualify then Kawakami’s cronies and big tech guy scoop the rest up and control the vacation condo rental market.
They’ll shrink the available vacation condo rental market raise prices which will price out low end Kauai vacationers which cuts the amount of tourist who can stay on the island at any given time.
Richard C. sees exactly what is going on. What a crock. The dishonesty, consolidation, and targeting of out-of-state owners and visitors for insane taxes is legalized theft. Plain and simple. To retain power, government just have to make sure that the locals are happier about reduced housing prices and tourist traffic than they are mad about their family having to move to Las Vegas or elsewhere on the mainland because of the greatly reduced revenue (tax and sales) and jobs from the eviscerated tourism industry.
They think tech is their savior, when tech (Air B&B, VRBO, etc) and CA migrants created the problem to begin with. Good luck with that. Kauai should know better than most that big tech isn’t their friend. Just look at Zuckerberg’s walled outpost and semi-private beach on their island. They’re the real imperialists here, not tourists who come, stay in short-term housing, create jobs, spend (lots of) money, then leave. Not sure how many jobs Zuck created, maybe some short-term construction ones to build his wall to keep the islanders out.
Ha! Maui tried that a few years ago and Starwood (now owned by Marriott) successfully sued and the timeshare owners received a refund. Cost Maui County millions.
I agree with giving the labs 96 hours to get test results back. That will create much less anxiety for our family of 5 flying to Hawaii on December 26. Especially since rapid result tests are less reliable, and not offered by Kaiser.
Barnum and bailey,s circus back in the day doesnt compare to the circus in hawaii right now. Its entertaining to read about.
Youd think hawaii was dealing with rules for dogs entering the state, not human beings. Its definitely ludicrous.
I’ve enjoyed watching the show as well!
And all for a state with a running average of 1 death a day. And a virus with a current death rate of a normal flu. How sad. Guess this will happen every flu season from now on.
exactly! And what co-morbidities did the deceased have? age & medical condition? “real” cause of death? California’s #’s are a super mess! since our rolling lock-downs for over 8 months, hospitals in California have Never been over-whelmed (& I know because my brother-in-law runs one) but here we are again with LA County in another lock-down (we in OC are open:)….hundreds of LA restaurants will never open again & minority children are getting 0-No education as most do not participate in online “non-learning”….build a temp hospital in Kauai and open already!
The reason that the California hospitals haven’t been overrun is Because of the things you are complaining about. but that’s California, I thought that we were talking about Hawaii here?
Exactly why we are not even looking at 2021… when this is over, all it will take is someone to sneeze on Molakai and the whole state will go into panic and chaos and shutdowns again . We were there when this broke out for a long term stay and our treatment by local officials and law enforcement was just this side of barbaric. The island I loved is now possessed by “The Sky is Falling” party of control and chaos. So sad.
More mis-information, hey Beat, you might want to check on some of the stuff people are posting here. According to Johns Hopkins, the mortality rate is 2%. But it’s not just about the mortality rate, it’s about the hospitalization rate/capacity as well. Hawaii has done a great job of protecting it’s citizens from pandemic so far, and all of this bashing of their government because they are having trouble trying to figure out how to balance that protection and keeping their economy going seems a bit harsh to me. Pretending there’s NO pandemic on isn’t the solution. If people would all wear masks and socially distance, then we could bend down the curve. But too many people think that wearing a mask is some kind of affront to their individual rights that it’s not working. So, lockdowns and required testing are the next option. But again, more whining and complaining about THAT … I’m glad *I* not in charge!
100%
YES!!!!
Mortality rate from when? Back in March and April when there were no effective therapies? Or from the last few months when treatment is light years ahead of what was. I’m willing to bank my life on the ‘current’ 1% or less rather than the 10 month 2% you quote. And as for masks, some of the lowest infection rates are from areas where there are no mask police and common sense is followed. Masks are debateable.
exactly….
Lord Have Mercy!!
I figure I have 62 days to see if travel to Hawaii has some kind of stability. (February 15 travel date)
I don’t have high hopes for this trip….but I try to keep a glimmer of hope.
I leave Feb 1 for a week in Maui so I feel ya. I’ve done my sightseeing. I don’t need to do that anymore. Ill just be on the same beach for a week. If Maui shuts down I don’t know what I’m gonna do.
I wonder if Hawaiians who are against all travel realize just how badly their economy has been damaged and how long the effects will last.
Tax revenues are in the tank. There’s no tourism money coming into the government. So far, the politicians have managed to mask the extent of the damage using federal dollars to minimize these effects. Those federal subsidies are going to go away folks and it is only then that Hawaiians will realize the extent of the damage.
Hawaii has been running a significant deficit for years now and this event along with that deficit spending is going to crash Hawaii’s economy. Hard.
Hawaiians shouldn’t be expecting much in the way of government services for several years. If you think times are tough now, just wait.
Friendly reminder: “Hawaiians” = Native Hawaiians. Please use “Hawaiʻi residents” or similar if you are describing those who reside in the state. Thank you!
I find it interesting how people who don’t live there have such opinions about what people who Do think and want…
I write as a lucky Hawai’i resident simply to say these Kauai Guys know what they are talking about. Some things are universal, such as wrong moments to maneuver for future political advantage. I am sorry about the pandemic, I am sorry about necessary health restrictions Hawai’i and our individual counties have imposed, and I am sorry about cancelled plans and postponed major celebrations. Our own Maui niece had to downsize her March wedding from 180 to 10 in the backyard. We know what doing without is. We did not Thanksgiving with our 50 plus island Ohana, nor will we Christmas with them. It hurts. But we are a unique state. We have limited medical resources. If I need a specialist not available on Maui, I can’t drive to Honolulu or to the Mainland. It’s not California, or Kansas, or New York. We are the most remote island archipelago on this planet. This land and its people are strong, but fragile. But it is a land like no other. That’s why I live here and you choose to vacation or more here. Please understand why we all need to do what we must to malama (take care and respect). Mahalo nui.
Yes! Thank you. Well said! Our numbers are up on Maui and it is unnerving.
Nancy,
Thank you for your balanced, well reasoned post. Your points are correct. I, for one, will be back to Hawaii once it is safe to travel again.
Hi nancy r. Lucky? I wanted to expand on your post. What your describing sounds like a rat race to me with lots of uncertainty. – Fk the economy and tourist economy, flip them off with one hand and take money with the other?
That really isnt aloha what’s happening in hawaii. Hope for the best but dont see your family? Pull together in hawaii but segregation with the usa more? Lots of controversy and opposing views and directions being taken!
Thank you. I am lucky enough to enjoy Hawaii as a vacation and hope to retire there when the time comes. Living in the Northeastern US I have taken for granted my geographical ease of availability to medical care, next day delivery shopping and general day to day living supplies and comforts. The reality is regardless of anyone’s political or personal views an island provides for a very different infrastructure and needs then most of us are accustom to. The island of Kuaui has just 9 ICU beds on the entire island! So that is 9 beds for ANY ICU need not just covid. I do not live in a city but have 5 hospitals within 20 minute drive of my home and each hospital has 3 to 5 times that amount of ICU beds. If that doesn’t put it into perspective then I don’t how to….
Nancy
Thank you for your very nice heart felt comment. Really presented a good first hand take on how residents of Hawaii feel about the pandemic and the sacrifices you are making during this stressful period.
Richard
Well said. Mahalo.
Aloha state??😂😂😂😂State of Confusion!
Mahalo for nothin!
I’m not too worried about quarantines. Currently, I’m stuck in CA but have a ticket to return to Kauai on April 5, 2021. Hopefully, the Chinese flu will be gone by then. The only thing I’m concerned about right now is the sentencing of the Kealohas. Have you heard anything yet?
Thank you
Eddie
Hi Eddie.
Former Honolulu Prosecutor Katherine Kealoha was just sentenced to 13 years in prison for corruption.
Aloha.
Timber’s is $874 per night?! With no beach access? Are they offering 5 star dining and unlimited alcohol for that price?
Food and Booze and Greens Fees not included. After all that, resort fees, taxes, tips, you’re talking about $3K per day for a couple.
The part I don’t get is why people who can afford that (and there are plenty of people who can), would bother, when there are plenty of other $3K per couple per day resorts around the planet that don’t require you to wear a monitoring bracelet, and you can leave the resort to go to the beach, dine elsewhere, etc. But, Timbers must have people wanting it, or they would be out buying more bracelets. Maybe the shut down is Kawakami’s way of helping them generate more customers?
I’m afraid that this is future of Hawaii tourism. A playground for the wealthy who can afford these exorbitant nightly ($874) rates. The working stiff mainlanders who save all year for a weeks vacation in paradise are becoming dinosaurs. Hope I’m wrong.
Thanks again to BOH for posting different points of view and keeping us in the loop. This is my go-to site for anything Hawaii. But I’m wondering. Their seems to be a lot of antipathy from some of your resident commenters regarding “mainland” tourists. Without taking sides, is that the vibe that you are getting from your friends and business associates in Kauai?
Hi Curtis.
Thanks for your countless comments over the past several years. In a word, no it definitely is not.
ALoha.
Another prime example of Camp Chaos in full bloom where politicians are more concerned about their political careers than they are about the overall survival of Hawaii! Time to recall Little Iggy now!
This is an embarrassment. The “Leaders” took months to come to a solution, less than five weeks to squabble and destroy it and have no viable solution for the future. If they don’t start now, they won’t be able to handle the logistics of having vaccinated people arrive. They obviously believe that failure Is an option.
Sometimes I ask myself, if the Gentlemen mentioned above, live on this planet. The present program was a good start and maybe does need some improvement to satisfy concerned residents. So, test again upon arrival. Period. Caroline and I had 5 wonderful weeks on Maui. I did not see any visitors not playing by the rules. Just some homeless guys in Lahaina, smoking pot, did not care. The businesse and visitors did their best to obey the rules to keep everyone safe. It was just a great time without any problems. I am already planning to came back in April for 6 weeks, but this time around I might wait and see if the mayors and goverment officials come to some kind of consensus to keep at least some visitors coming to enjoy the beautiful islands.
I was upset to read your derogatory comment about Josh Green. He is the only one with a plan based in science the others are simply Russian Roulette. Unfortunately the lives put at risk are those on the plane and an enlarged risk of exposure for locals. Ka’anapali visitors were blatantly disregarding the mandatory mask rules over the weekend yet they wonder why the spirit of aloha is disappearing.
I value my family’s life and the people of Hawaii more than whining tourists. In Kauai we have only 9 ICU beds.What happens if………!!! Think!
Aloha and thank you for these updates. I rely so much on BOH.
I have a few questions (who doesn’t). If you come to Kauai during this quarantine period of Dec 2-? (which is probably going to be the month of December or two testing cycles) it is my understanding you must quarantine the full 14 days. You can’t come over and plan on a 5 night stay at Timbers for $800 a night and then leave. Is that correct?
Lt Green’s idea is very similar to the Bahamas which has worked just fine and they have low rates of infection. (my husband is there right now). You can test 5 days before, they rapid test you again at the major airport like Nassau (free) and if you stay over a certain length of time, you test again. They also allow you to pre test anywhere as long as its a PCR test (the same test Hawaii requires). This would eliminate the rush on CVS, Vault and Walgreens (which seems to be the only place that has their stuff together. Friends of mine never received their VAULT test to their home). You can pay zero through insurance or for faster results pay a lot to have peace of mind. My husband found a lab for $200 where he could test at 10am and get results back at 7pm that evening. He said it was easy and he preordered the test so it was waiting for him. Within the travel docs he has to fill out, it includes insurance if he gets covid while over there (you pay for the travel visa docs). It pays $500 per day for a hotel up to 14 days. If HI wants to blame CA for the rise in cases (and I am hearing they are) please remind your readers that CA is #39 on the stats for covid cases per capita. North Dakota and SD are the highest. HI is the lowest.
Hi Joan.
Thank you. The proposed change would be to test within 4 days of departure, not 5. And yes you can go to a bubble resort for any number of days, because you won’t ever be out on the island, and merely confined there.
Aloha.
At this point I just have to shake my head and wait for whatever plan is in place in late February. The constant changes will not help tourism, and may seriously hurt it. Politics should have no influence on public health policy, but we all know this virus and its treatment have been politicized from the beginning. Thank you BOH for keeping us up to date on this comedy of errors!
If Dr. Green is designated to make the recommendations, political differences aside, what can be done to give him back his power?
Yes!! We trust Josh and he is a doctor!
I love Kauai, but I will not return to stay at a “resort” with no beach access, room rates at over 800 per night & having to be quarantined! Plus I am not interested in a resort experience-I go to Kauai for the beauty of the island, the people & the local food & goods. We love going to the farmer markets & exploring the island. I don’t know what the answer is for Kauai, they are a small island that needs protection,but I feel like the mayor has hurt the island by shutting down right after opening. Tourists will not want to make plans because of the uncertainty
Any news/updates for travel to Maui?
My family and I were lucky to get to spend a week on Kauai just before the new restrictions. That said, regarding the pre travel testing….you can be Covid free on the day of your test and unless you isolate you are not necessarily Covid free upon arrival in the Islands. I think they would extremely smart to figure out how to do the rapid test for everyone upon arrival. Release people in small groups from the planes and have proper holding areas. They have every right and the responsibility to protect the health of the people of Hawaii. I would be inclined to listen to the doc over there as opposed to the politicians, understanding he is one. Seems he and the Kauai mayor are the only two who are worried more about lives and less about money. IF masks work, then once on island and wearing them is required of visitors then open up, but first be sure people, have not arrived infected.
The problem with rapid testing is that they are less reliable for asymptomatic cases. The tests from one manufacturer produce too many false positives, from the other manufacturer too many false negatives. Too much uncertainty either way. Would people be willing to pay the high price of a Hawaii vacation if there is a chance for incorrect test results and a ruined vacation?
Hawaii is a complete mess! Your politicians need to get their crud together! The constant changes are an embarrassment to the residents of Hawaii. We have a trip scheduled for July 2021 and I have very little hope that the islands will have ironed out anything consistent even by then. Completely ridiculous!
I am curious if the governor or mayors have given any thought to when the vaccine comes out? If someone has proof of getting the vaccine (and after whatever the waiting period might be for it to take effect) would they no longer have to be tested or quarantined? Might they be welcomed on any island?
Thank you for your consideration of this question,
Karen
Hi Karen.
This will be a changing situation for a long time to come.
Aloha.
Can Hawaii get anymore screwed up?
We’ll see soon.
Welcome to the Covid Clowns pie throwing contest! Hawaii just can’t manage to get its act together. I won’t be visiting until I have had a vaccine and perhaps not even then depending on the crazy hoops we will innevitably have to jump through!
Good call
You may want to take a much closer look at this “vaccine”. It is the most dangerous one ever created. I only say this because I care about you. Look at the Childrens Health Defense website if you are interested. Be well.
@WOC – please do not promote anti-vaccine websites and organizations here.
Per Wikipedia:
“Children’s Health Defense is an American 501c3 nonprofit advocacy organization,[1] known for its anti-vaccine activism. Much of the material put forth by the organization involves misinformation on vaccines and anti-vaccine propaganda”
Which vaccine are you referring to? There is more than one.
CHD is an anti-vaxxer organization that hates all vaccines. I wouldn’t use them for information about the safety of anything. I would stick to what the organizations that are responsible for making sure the vaccines are safe like the CDC, the WHO, and the FDA have to say on the topic and not get my info from conspiracy theory websites that don’t have a single shred of actual scientific evidence for what they are peddling.
One of the issues that keeps coming up is how quickly these vaccines are being developed. Please keep in mind that:
1. New methods of developing these vaccines helped to increase the rate of development and we have developed vaccines for other strains of COVID.
2. Typically, big pharma takes a long time to develop drugs because they want to spread out the costs of development. In this case, a lot of those costs ended up being paid by the government by, for example, pre-purchasing the vaccines.
Also keep in mind that, in spite of what certain people are saying, it’s going to be a while before the vaccine rolls out to “ordinary people”. I wouldn’t expect to be able to get the vaccine before spring of 2021 unless you’re elderly, living in some kind of home, a healthcare worker, etc. Those folks might start getting it as soon as the end of this year. Then it will roll out to more and more “essential workers” over the first quarter of 2021, and as I said, by the time the general public can get it, it’s probably going to be April or May.
Finally, in order for the vaccine to stop the spread of COVID-19, a significant portion of the population will need to get vaccinated. So, expect that we will continue to have to wear masks, social distance, and have some lockdowns until that happens. If too many people won’t take the vaccine, then we will be in a permanent state of “lockdown” so to speak.
From Media Bias Fact check website:
Children’s Health Defense
– Conspiracy – Junk Science – Propaganda – Fake News – Not Credible – Anti-Vaxx – Pseudoscience
Factual Reporting: Low – Not Credible – Not Reliable – Fake News – Bias
CONSPIRACY-PSEUDOSCIENCE
Sources in the Conspiracy-Pseudoscience category may publish unverifiable information that is not always supported by evidence. These sources may be untrustworthy for credible/verifiable information, therefore fact checking and further investigation is recommended on a per article basis when obtaining information from these sources. See all Conspiracy-Pseudoscience sources.
Overall, we rate the Children’s Health Defense a strong conspiracy and quackery level advocacy group that frequently promotes unsupported claims. We also rate them low for factual reporting due to the promotion of propaganda as well as several failed fact checks.
Perfect! I hear Florida’s very nice right now…..
Yup, well, except for that whole COVID and people dying thing …
My family had been considering traveling to Hawaii for Christmas/New Years. But with the confusing and changing overly burdensome Covid-related testing requirements, we have opted to go elsewhere. Aloha, adios, sayōnara Hawaii!
A very wise choice! Spend your money where chaos and confusion isn’t thriving.
C with too many pots on boil, Green might know a little something about diseases, he being in the field, Kawakami taking care of business protecting Kauai islanders, at high risk for super spreader devastation. Once out there, nothing stops this deadly virus. Hawaii counts low because everyone is in there pitching
Deadly!? 99.7% survival rate unless you have significant underlying health issues so maybe try again with facts.
Can we Please stop it with that sill number. First , it’s just Wrong . The deaths from COVID-19 have crossed 260K in this country and is predicted to reach 300K by the end of the year, or very early next year. So, with a population of 320 million, that’s pretty close to 1% of the entire population, not just the people who have COVID. According to a study by Johns Hopkins, the mortality rate for the US is about 2%. But this isn’t just about deaths, it’s about people getting so ill they have to be admitted to the ICU. It’s about the fact that if people continue to not take this seriously, the infection rate, will continue to skyrocket like it is right now, and we will run out of hospital capacity.
Not taking a side in your fight but get your math right. $300,000 is not 1%. It’s .1% of the population.
Al, you’re right, missed the “.” there …
The need to “vacation” is not great than the health and safety of the people of Hawaii.
Health and safety rely on having an economy. When politicians voluntarily kill 25% of the economy, how does that prioritize health and safety in the long run? This is sheer madness, brought on by an unjustified fear of a virus that’s lethality has consistently been exaggerated, even as the official numbers have been repeatedly revised down and put into context. Read some real news or, even better, use all that free time you have from not having a fully active economy and read the Source Materials .
Put your critical thinking hat on and review the evidence yourself. Science isn’t some black box that only the elite can comprehend. You don’t need to understand RNA, scanning electron microscopes, or string theory to know that these numbers are being grossly exaggerated and to see that the data is very dirty here. Crap in, crap out.
The authors are right: the crisis is being politicized for individual gain. These guys are playing politics with your lives, but until you see it, you’ll just go along with it and blame the mouth-breathers who don’t wear masks or stand 5 feet away from you (instead of the necessary 6!) in the grocery check-out line. Good luck with that, Hawaii. I will miss you, but you will miss us filthy, selfish tourists more.
I’m a Canadian who has visited Hawaii at least 60 times in my lifetime. For many years I spent every winter in Hawaii, avoiding the snow at home. I will now completely avoid Hawaii as it is so muddled, so inconsistent that there is no chance a trip there would be successful. Having this level of governmental confusion visible to the whole world should be a massive embarrassment to Hawaii. You deserve better, your visitors deserve better. Those of us who love Hawaii, respect the host culture and are eager to support local businesses are frustrated and heart broken.
Massive embarrassment?
No…That would be Senator Mazie Hirono!
My family is flying to Maui this Saturday – we are getting tested with Vault Health on Wednesday. We are so concerned about all of the changes – Vault Health customer service was responsive to my email and the recommended that we put STAT HAWAII TRAVEL on the Overnight box and the bag inside.
The 96 Hour window would be a big help, in-airport testing upon arrival is a good idea. A shorter quarantine also makes sense – I’ve read that 2-weeks is overkill and people are contagious for about 4 days after symptoms.
We are supposed to arrive to Maui on Saturday as well. Hopefully they do not make any last minute changes. Maui was not mentioned so fingers crossed!
I agree on the 96 hours.
These politicians won’t be happy until they Bankrupt all the businesses in Hawaii.
The deadly SARS-Vo-2 isn’t happy unless it kills as many people it can, and byproduct, inoperable businesses. States exist to make money, Hawaii, top of the charts.
Deadly!? 99.7% survival rate so try again!
It’s 2% according to Johns Hopkins, please stop spreading misinformation. Also, it’s Not just about the mortality rate. It’s about how many people have to get admitted to the ICU, etc. Hawaii has limited hospital capacity.
You should probably take your own advice, and “stop spreading misinformation”. The mortality rate is NOT 2%. You’re utterly confused…🤦♂️
Tell it to the CDC. I was being optimistic. “The overall weekly hospitalization rate is at its highest point since the beginning of the pandemic, with steep increases in adults aged 65 years and older. Based on death certificate data, the percentage of deaths attributed to PIC for week 48 was 12.8% and, while declining compared with week 47 (18.6%), remains above the epidemic threshold. The weekly percentages of deaths due to PIC increased for seven weeks from early October through mid-November and are expected to increase for the most recent weeks as additional data are reported. Hospitalization rates for the most recent week are also expected to increase as additional data are reported.” More details here: cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidview/index.html
You previously said, “According to a study by Johns Hopkins, the mortality rate for the US is about 2%.” That is absolutely false, as there is No study that says “the Mortality rate is 2%”.
There is a study that shows “the number of deaths either per 100 confirmed cases (observed case-fatality ratio) or per 100,000 population”, and it represents a country’s general population, with both confirmed cases, unconfirmed cases, and healthy people.
Clearly your pushing inaccurate information, when 2% is not the representation of the population’s “mortality rate”, when it’s the “observed case-fatality ratio”, that doesn’t take into consideration the unconfirmed cases, and the healthy.
The actual mortality rate in that same study would be the number of deaths per 100k people for the US, which is currently at 85.26, and is an .08526% mortality rate. This, in turn converts to a 99.91474% survival rate. So, Don was actually giving a conservative number. Your optimism is abundantly underwhelming, Joerg…
Jim R. Is spot on! Lots of ignorant people (and dishonest politicians… Redundant?) compare apples to oranges when comparing case fatality rates to infection fatality rates. The reason the flu looks so much less deadly is because assumptions about the number of infected are extrapolated from the confirmed case number. With COVID, they’re always citing the much lower confirmed case number without extrapolating for all of the unconfirmed cases (while simultaneously whining that we don’t have enough testing to confirm all cases!). It’s completely misleading at best, fraud at worst.
I absolutely agree! My military son will finally be leaving Hawaii for good on December 18th, after 3 yrs of military service there! I’m so thankful, because I haven’t been able to see my grandson because of all this nonsense! I could care less if I ever see Hawaii again! Not worth the political crap!